Press Release
August 4, 2020

Sen. Francis Tolentino Transcription on Senate Hearing Re PhilHealth

(Sen. Tol) Mr. Cabading, you were appointed as member of the board July 2019. Tama po ba?

- Positive.

So by August if you can recall, and if my memory serves me right was there a directive coming from the president of the Philippines, President Duterte? Kasi gusto ko ring linawin to na dapat matulungan ang pangulo na nagbigay ng direktiba sa lahat ng PhilHealth vice presidents kung hindi ako nagkakamali pati board members to tender their courtesy resignations, are you aware of this Mr. Cabading?

- Yes.

Was there a consequential action coming from the PhilHealth board, a resolution perhaps, resolving requiring all members of the board as well as the vice presidents to tender their resignation, was it passed? Was there a board resolution to that effect?

- Yes Mr. Senator.

Pumirma ka don, Mr. Cabading?

- Yes po.

May I direct this question to Gen. Morales? Nagkaroon ng board resolution August upon the directive of the President of the Philippines for the officials of PhilHealth to tender their resignations. And there was a board resolution as per Mr. Cabading, can you confirm?

- Senator, I think that presidential directive covered only the members of the board and did not extend down to the vice presidents of the corporation. But there was a board resolution asking for the courtesy resignations of all SG-26.

So Gen. Morales, we are now referring to two board resolutions? One, is the resolution which emanated from the directive of President Duterte. Two, is a board resolution requiring the vice presidents to resign? Alin po dito ang napatupad na? Kung meron.

- Yung pangalawa po which is supposedly ako po ang magpapatupad, but I was a member of the board already at that time and I sought to seek a qualification to the board resolution which would heed the President and Chief Executive Officer na option to implement kung sino po ang ipapa-resign thru courtesy resignation. My reason po for asking that is that I wanted to continue cooperating or running the corporation and a must resignation of SG-26 executives..

SG means salary grade 26?

- Yes po Salary Grade 26.. in my opinion would be too disruptive to the corporation.

So you exercise a certain degree of discretion, not to implement a board resolution, because you're perception is that the functioning of the entire PhilHealth will be paralyzed. Pero siguro po Gen. Morales, I would like to remind you of the administrative code of the Philippines specifically Sec. 38. And I'm quoting Sec. B thereof.. Matters of day to day administration pertaining to the internal operations shall be left to your discretion. In terms of conflict, since you're an attached agency of the department of Health, pwede kang kumonsulta sa DOH. In terms of conflict again, kapag hindi pa rin kayo nagkakasundo, ay dapat po iakyat sa presidente ng Pilipinas. Kinonsulta niyo po ba si Sec. Duque tungkol dito?

- Opo. Sya po ang umuupo na Chairman..

So ibig sabihin, hindi pumayag si Sec. Duque na mag-resign? Yung mga tinutukoy niyo na salary grade and above?

- Opo. Pumayag po sya doon sa..

Pumayag siya subalit hindi ninyo inimplement? So Gen. Morales, that would mean a clear and flagrant violation of Sec. 38 of the Administrative Code of the Philippines which is Executive Order 292. More so, because there was a previous directive from the President of the Philippines to tender resignations. Tama po ba yun sa pagkakaintindi ko na hindi ninyo sinunod?

- Ang alam ko sir na directive ng president, only covered the board members. Hindi ho yung executives ng company.

But Gen Morales. Ito pong tinutukoy niyo na Salary Grade and above, at palagay ko nakikinig din naman ako minsan sa inyo. Na-interview kayo minsan sa isang radio program two weeks ago. Natanong kayo kung na-implement niyo na yung resolution, ang sabi niyo po and I'm referring to 20 officers, ang sabi niyo po with all due respect, ay na-implement na. Pero ngayon kasasabi ninyo na hindi ninyo in-implement. At sa aking pagkakalaam, correct me if I'm wrong and I'm asking Mr. Cabading, nag-issue po ng Memorandum Circular 2020-0037, nagkaron kayo ng isang PhilHealth circulate memorandum na yung tinutukoy ko na dapat pag-resign-in dahil don sa board resolution na hindi ninyo pinatupad dahil sila po ay may kaso sa Ombudsman, under investigation, ay na-promote pa, na-promote pa. Hindi na pinag-resign. Hindi na pinag-suspend, ipinromote pa. Palagay ko po, Gen. Morales, kailangan pong maipaliwanag natin ito dahil nabigyan pa ho sila ng, kung sinasabi niyo po kanina, mapa-paralyze kayo kung sila ay mag-reresign. E bakit naman po kailangang i-promote pa. Pwede po bang sagutin natin ito?

- I think po yung nirerefer ninyong na-promote, wala pong kasong na-file sa kanila. It think this has something to do with the WellMed case. Ngayon nagbigay po kami ng mga dokumento sa NBI at humingi pa sila ng mga statement, dito ho sa 20.

Gen. Morales, maging si Sec. Roque, alam kong nag-file ng kaso. Na-file-an niya ng kaso itong mga tao na ito. Ito pa ang na-promote. Records will bear me out. Wala lang dito si Sec. Roque pero be that as it may, bakit naman po sa halip an ma-suspend o sang-ayon sa board resolution niyo ay pag-resign-in, ay pinromote pa? What is the management rationale for this? Why give a premium to persons who are supposed to be out of the government service to be promoted?

- These people po, ito pong 20 na ang-submit ng information sa NBI, were not facing a case, wala pong na-file na kaso sa kanila. Wala pong kasong na-file.

Gen. Morales, you are underoath.

- Opo

You are unde roath and siguro mamaya, we can show documents and Sen. Lacson can probably provide documents that some of the personalities involved here were even promoted. You are under oath. Alam niyo naman po yung consequences ng perjury. And I'm also warning the other resource persons here. Kanina si Atty. Del Rosario out of respect to the senate, never raise your voice especially in speaking before Sen. Lacson o kung sinuman nandito. So wala na-promote? So going to another question, back to Mr. Cabading..

- (Sen. Sotto) Wait what do you mean walang na-promote, akala ko may na-promote.

Walang na-suspend, walang inimplement, walang nag-resign.

- Meron hong nag-leave na tatlo, they serve, I think they went on a leave and then natapos na po yung leave na yan, bumalik na po sila. The reason for that is during deterim, there was an evidence that was discovered to implicate them.

(Sen. Sotto) When you say yung na-promote ay walang kaso, are you speaking to the best of your knowledge or hindi mo alam na may kaso?

- With the best of my knowledge pow ala pong administrative na kaso wala rin pong na-file na kaso sa korte.

(Sen. Sotto) They will confront you with the case filed but anyway, Sen. Tolentino bago ka magtuloy, there is another point na magandang tanungin na rin, samantalahin ko lang, you had a radio interview with Arnold Clavio and he asked you if you knew what happened in the whole session in a zoom meeting, and you said you were not there, you were not present. Bakit sinabi mong wala kayo don e nandon kayo?

(Sen. Tol) Before I jump into another point, Gen. Morales, will there be a time when you will implement the said board resolution, we're talking about the two board resolutions, number one is the board resolution complying with the directive of the President of the Philippines and the second resolution is the resolution asking for the courtesy resignation of the salary grade 26 and above officials. Ano po ba tong kapangyarihan ng isang pangulo ng PhilHealth. Pwede bang hindi na iimplement yon o i-archive na lang yon? Wala po ba tayong nakikitang, I think you have legal department here, wala po bang tayong nakikitang violations? Na nagpasa ng resolution na hindi ipinatupad? Tinatanong ko kayo ngayon, balak niyo pa bang ipatupad ito o hindi na?

- Yun pong utos ng presidente tungkol sa presidente, I think it only covers the members of the board. But hindi pa rin po ako member of the board noong lumabas yon. Yun pong board resolution asking for the resignation of the SG 26 is still open. Still available to whoever sits as the president, to implement it.

Kaya ko po nabanggit yan kasi ang naririnig ko lagi sa inyo , bukambibig ninyo yung sindikato. Na may sindikato dito, na kumikilos, hindi po ba tamang direksyon yon na ipakita sa mga miyembro ng sindikato, sa mga kawani ng PhilHealth na naglilingkod nang matapat at marangal na ang pangulo ng PhilHealth ay pinatutupad ang isang board resolution na magpapakita na kaya ninyong gibain ang sindikato. Kasi lagi ninyong sinasabi, gusto ninyo ipakita ang yung reporma subalit maraming balakid at kabilang dito ang sindikato. Siguro nakatingin po ang sambayanan kung kaya niyo pong gawin yan. Kung hindi e patuloy lang po tayong makakaron ng ganitong imbestigasyon, wala pong magiging resulta, Gen. Morales.

- Certainly ho. Kung meron pong ebidensya along the way hindi po ako mag-aatubiling iimplement yung resolution na yan na pagbibitiw.

Before you implement a board resolution, you will still seek for additional evidence circumstantial otherwise, e meron nang board resolution. Hindi naman po mag-iisue ng board resolution ang board ninyo na wala silang basehan.

- I understand po these executives are protected by the civil service law, they cannot be..

But that's another venue. That is another matter for the Civil Service Commission or the Ombudsman to decide. Going to another matter, may I have Mr. Cabading back? Mr. Cabading are you still there?

- Yes I'm here

So my question is this, kanina po napag-usapan yung IRM, yung mga gastos ng PhilHealth. Nabanggit din ni Atty. Kit mamaya tatanungin ko sya. Na 15 billion pesos ang nawawala na sa kaniyang estimate sa nakaraang korapsyon, wastage ng funds ng PhilHealth. At nabanggit din kanina, na 114 billion na ang nagastos, correct me if I'm wrong, dahil po dito sa pandemic.

- 14 billion, 14 billion. Not 114.

14 billion. That's why I asked that I be corrected. So maraming nakakarating sa akin Mr. Cabading and I hope Gen. Morales, Atty. Kit I forgot your last name akala ko Amerikano kanina, marami pong nakakarating sa akin na marami daw pasyente nap ag pumupunta sa ospital na kahit hindi COVID ay ginagawang COVID para maka-claim. Ang tawag na po dito ay fake COVIDs at sila po ay nakakakuha ng claim. Halimbawa po sa Cebu, napakataas po ng naging COVID spike sa Cebu. Meron pong isang stabbing incident sa Carmen, Cebu na pagkatapos pong masaksak, dinala sa ospital, ini-swab, nagkataong negative pa, kinremate pa. Kaya itong mga magulang ngayon, naghahanap ng hustisya, paano ngayon iimbestigahan ng pulis e na-cremate na? meron naman isang insidente sa lalawigan ng Cebu sa Pasil, Cebu City naaksidente sa motorsiklo, pagdating sa ospital, sinwab, positive, lahat ng totally unrelated yung aksidente, e lahat chinarge na dito sa Philhealth. Meron po ba kayo Mr. Cabading, na maa-isolate niyo po ba bilang board member yung nakikita niyo po ba yung pananaw ko na baka naman maraming non-COVID cases, kanina diniscuss yun ni Sen. Lacson, ang nabayaran gn PhilHealth kahit hindi COVID, lumaki tuloy, lumobo. Ngayon nga 106,330 na tayo sa datos ng DOH. Yung nasawi ay malaki-laki na rin. Hindi kaya nagkagulo na tong sistema natin sa PhilHealth na yung di COVID-related ay nabayaran. Lumobo na yung gastusin. Kasi si Presidente, hiling niya narinig niyo ng isang araw. Magkaron sya ng 20 billion. Para pag nagkaron ng vaccine, maibigay sa mahihirap. E kung ang sinasabi ni Atty Kit kanina, 15 billion naubos na sa corruption, 5 billion na lang ang kulang. Can you affirm this Mr. Cabading? Or baka meron ka pang instances sa inyong lugar, nasaan ka ba ngayon? Zamboanga? Tungkol sa sinasabi ko.

- Yes, Zamboanga. That is the danger now. But I'm receiving actual report from the ground, direct information about patient died with non-COVID and charged to COVID. And this is a COVID case ang nagreport naman sa akin is yung COVID case talaga na namatay yung wife niya kahapon but he was telling me there was a case in other hospitals na hindi makabayad ng kalahating milyon charged to COVID. So this is the danger of the IRM. Anyway I asked the regional director of Cebu to immediately create such a team of investigator to conduct this. Kasi kung yan po ang trend, hindi po natin yan ma-plug agad, I don't think the money of PhilHealth would last even up to end of the year. That's my projection po. Because we have money, actually sinasabing may pera tayo pero ang pera naiwan sa PhilHealth ay kulang pang pambayad ng utang. Yung regular, benefit claim. We're already in the cliff, your honor, financially. And that I could say confidentially, talagang tagilid na. we have to check on this issue of charging Non-COVID to COVID debt. Thank you po.

Mr. President my time is up, hindi ko na natanong si Atty. Kit. I respect the next senator in line.

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